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Thread: Which to choose?

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by odie_88 View Post
    Yeah the 2toned substrate is quite good value...(I know as I was the one that took the pictures for him lol)
    Can someone enlighten me what 2toned substrate is?

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by happyfins View Post
    Can someone enlighten me what 2toned substrate is?
    http://www.aquariumlife.com.au/showt...Generating-Sub

  3. #18
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    Thanks! Sounds great!

  4. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Madmerv View Post
    Dont give up on 2Toned.

    First the pebbles. Marble reacts with acid, the stronger the acid the stronger the reaction. Vinegar is not that strong, you can drink it. Totally immerse a pebble in the vinegar and wait 5 min. If there are bubbles, of any magnitude, coming off the pebble then it is what you want. Or pull up at any building site and ask the brickie for a couple of drops of real acid and see if it reacts.
    Ok, I ended up buying a small bag of pebbles and got all sciencey. I added acid buffer (pH down) to a cup of white vinegar to increase the acidity. I chucked in a handful of pebbles and some bubbled, some didn't. The bubbles had mostly stopped by about the 10min mark. So I'm going to assume that there is at least some marble in the mix.

    Some people dont like the look of the not quite white, not really grey, pool sand so you can cap 2Toned sub with any other type of sand. Just be aware that angular sands will compact easier and therefor have to be the correct thickness to allow some water flow.
    I ended up buying two 2k bags of ADA La Plata sand as it looked nice and since my tank is small I figured I really only need one bag to cap it.

    The last recommendation i have is be EXACT with the blood and bone. Working from memory, so double check this please, it's one measured tablespoon of B&B per square foot. Do not go heavy thinking the plants will love it. That is a disaster waiting to happen.
    My tank is 28cm x 25cm (or 30cm if you can the area where the heater/filter sit). My plan is to use half a tablespoon of blood and bone. Hopefully that's enough to be effective but not cause too many issues.
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  5. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by anthonyrae View Post
    Until recently, I always kept between 30 and 65 tanks.
    ten EMBER TETRAS and TEN HASTATUS.
    Yesssssssss!! Clearly great minds think alike, etc! Do you have any pictures? That sounds really amazing. I love pygmy cories so much, Hastatus are my favourite but I've been sorely tempted by pygmaeus to of late.
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  6. #21

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    I'm almost ready for the rescape but after much reading I think I'll need to move the fishies into another tank while the 2Toned substrate settles and cycles. This means buying a second tank and a second filter. Which brings me back to my original post... do I set up a whole new tank?

    I really like the long of long, thin tanks with all the driftwood and stones bunched on the lefthand side and lots of moss. Without forking out for a fluval spec, are there any brands that make nice looking tanks with similar inbuilt space for filter and heater?
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainVader View Post
    I'm almost ready for the rescape but after much reading I think I'll need to move the fishies into another tank while the 2Toned substrate settles and cycles.
    I would not want to put you off buying another tank. I'm pretty sure that if you have a cycled filter, you can put the fish back in the tank as soon as you fill it. Have read others posts of doing it with no problems.
    Just fill the tank nice and slow so you dont disturb the bottom layers.

  8. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Madmerv View Post
    I'm pretty sure that if you have a cycled filter, you can put the fish back in the tank as soon as you fill it. Have read others posts of doing it with no problems.
    Just fill the tank nice and slow so you dont disturb the bottom layers.
    Hmmmm. I was under the impression that new substrate = new cycle, albeit slightly shorter when using a cycled filter. Also after reading the 2Toned thread, that I should wait at least 48 hours before introducing livestock again. I only have otos and ember tetras, so nothing that can't be replaced but I can't stand the thought of animals suffering as a result of my choices, so I want to do this as safely as possible for them.
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  9. #24
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    Difficult to predict with a DIY soil because of so many variables. The cycling is certainly way faster if you have a fully established filter.

    With aquasoil, even with an established filter, cycling can take a few weeks due to high ammonia leeching.

    Its hard to predict until you do it and double check your results.

  10. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    Difficult to predict with a DIY soil because of so many variables. The cycling is certainly way faster if you have a fully established filter.

    With aquasoil, even with an established filter, cycling can take a few weeks due to high ammonia leeching.

    Its hard to predict until you do it and double check your results.
    I'll be using propogating sand, blood and bone, marble chips, and ADA sand (so just straight sand, no fancy ferts or soil) will that mix leach ammonia?

    I've seen those products that you can add to speed up a cycle, are they worth it or just junk science designed so that we spend money unnecessarily?
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainVader View Post
    I'll be using propogating sand, blood and bone, marble chips, and ADA sand (so just straight sand, no fancy ferts or soil) will that mix leach ammonia?

    I've seen those products that you can add to speed up a cycle, are they worth it or just junk science designed so that we spend money unnecessarily?
    The capping sand, Your ADA sand, is there to stop the leaching of the ferts (blood and bone as well as osmocote ferts if used) from the bottom layer to the water column. If the cap is to thin then all the ferts will leach to the water fast leaving you with an inert sub. If it is to thick then compaction and anaerobic activity will happen. Stick to the recommended thickness and you will be right.
    The cycling of your tank is mainly the cycling of the filter to handle the ammonia load of the stock you keep in the tank. There is some cycling happening in the entire aquarium on other surfaces but this is minor compared to the filter media. Unless you are using a very small filter. Using other products with your already cycled filter is a complete waste of money. Squeezing your already cycled filter sponge into a tank with a new filter will guarantee that you get alive and active bacteria into the new tank and filter. No cost.
    Then you just have to wait for the bacteria to build up to the level that can handle the stocking that you desire.
    All of the tanks i have done with 2Toned subs required that i add an ammonia source for their cycling giving me a big indication that the sub was not leaching or leaching very little. All were fishless cycled so no addition of foods or waste from fish because each filter was new.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainVader View Post
    I've seen those products that you can add to speed up a cycle, are they worth it or just junk science designed so that we spend money unnecessarily?
    Wouldn't bother. Just use a cycled filter.

    I agree with Madmerv.

    I don't think anyone else has ever used the ADA la plata as a cap. Bear in mind that it will mix with the propopagting sand eventually and you won't be able to separate them.

  13. #28

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    I feel I should point out at this stage that my filter is a built in contraption which seems to consist of:

    - A small inlet vent at the bottom, rear right hand side
    - Some filter wool
    - A small pump that sits on the bottom and has a pipe leading up to the outlet hole on the rear top left.

    So as far as I can tell, water gets sucked in, moves through the filter wool, and is expelled out the top. I added extra filter wool so there's a huge amount of wool in there with beefy brown bacteria colonies. I'm worried that it's not enough and I've been considering running a second filter, like a HOB, just so that a) I have a cycled filter ready to go and b) if anything happens to inbuilt one I am safe.

    I am seriously worried about effing this up and killing everything, basically causing fishie ragnarok.

    Bear in mind that it will mix with the propopagting sand eventually and you won't be able to separate them.
    is there anyway to prevent this? a bigger layer of marble maybe? Or will that destroy the 2toned layers plan?

    There is some cycling happening in the entire aquarium on other surfaces but this is minor compared to the filter media
    This is good to know. I always thought that filter colony provided about 60% and substrate about 40% of the cycle, but it looks more like filter is 90% and substrate + other is about 10%?
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

  14. #29
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    Hmm that inbuilt filter sounds small maybe show us a picture?

    Fyi for a 30L tank I used to run an Eheim 2213 but that tank had CO2. Lots of flow is good for plants.

    You wont be able to prevent mixing if using 2toned sub.

    For such a small tank, probably easier to just use ADA amazonia but cycling will be 6 weeks.

  15. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    Hmm that inbuilt filter sounds small maybe show us a picture?

    Fyi for a 30L tank I used to run an Eheim 2213 but that tank had CO2. Lots of flow is good for plants.

    I'll take some pictures tonight and post them so you can all see what I'm getting at and I stop sounding like a crazy lady

    Wow, I had a 2213 on my three foot tank back in the day! how did you stop it from turning into a whirlpool??
    As a young boy, I dreamed of being a baseball; but tonight I say, we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!

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